Have your say & ask the experts

hammill:

The problem is that a lot of music is being mastered (or remastered) to only suit this type of listening and  music loses so much of its emotional appeal when the dynamics are removed.

Listening on earphones in a noisy environment or whilst commuting, cyling in traffic, hoovering etc is nothing new. It has been a norm for the 30 years ever since the Walkman appeared.

Much more likely is that the industry is 'dumbing down'. (Or deaf & dumbing down!)

Infantilism basically. Like a 3 year old with a sweet tooth who will not eat anything unless it is liberally coated in sugar or cannot read a book unless it has lots of pictures.

Maybe in some years time - when this entire generation has deafened itself - the rest of us will begin to get recordings again that are made with musical priorities uppermost.

dim_span:

and a follow up to my last post:

todays min wage in the USA is $7.25 ... so, times that by 258 hours and you will have $1870.50 ... (a rough calculation at todays exchange rate will give you £1128.98 ... which will give you a cryus 8xp, a naim nait xs, a Leema pulse, moon i-1, and a few others

some 'excerpts from current WHF reviews:

Naim nait XS: Loses grip on the deepest bass

Leema pulse: Can sound lightweight and querulous

moon i-1:Lacks the detail of the very best; low frequencies could be more taut

and I've never read a bad review on the Pioneer SA-9800

What are you talking about?? Those amps you mention didn't get bad reviews. The Naim, "The Nait XS is as musically engrossing an amplifier as we've heard at this price point. It'll worry the class leaders" 5 stars. The Leema, " For: Decent levels of build; extensive specification; fast, precise sound. Against: Can sound lightweight and querulous if poorly partnered (you missed out that part!), 5 stars. The Moon i-1, " The Moon's lack of all-out precision holds it back from five, but four stars in this competitive sector is still mighty impressive", 4 stars.


Are you telling me that the Pioneer was reviewed and didn't have one slight discrepancy against it??

chebby:

one off:

the record spot:

Source first an 80s invention? Linn LP12 anyone?

no idea really just thought linn and naim were behind the source first thing and the prat thing

woops your right the linn started in 1972

Yes the Ariston RD11 Linn Sondek was first made by Castle Engineering (Ivor's dad's company) in 1972 to a design by Hamish Robertson copied from the Thorens TD150 - itself copied from the original Acoustic Research turntable (designed by Ed Villchur)

Obviously it was a well copied/nicked 1960s unique 80s Linn HAA! invention.

 

 

I think the point here is not that the Linn was the first high quality turntable that was built, or that its' design was a radical or new departure from that which had gone before, but that the firm were among the first at the time to promote the idea that the source was the most important element in the chain.

The other manufacturers produced their equipment at a time when the speaker was generally reckoned to be the most important element. Design quality isn't an issue here; those other decks stand up well today and alongside the Garrard 301 and 401 classics of the 50s as well, but the order of importance in which qudio gear was placed relative to other components in a system is.

chebby:

Well mixed/mastered material still sounds excellent on an iPod (or internet radio) despite compression - down to even 128kbps - so the argument that it's ... "...better off being you that will do the crushing."  does not really stand up.

Actually, that is because mp3 does not damaging original dynamic range of record.

Gerrardasnails:

dim_span:

and a follow up to my last post:

todays min wage in the USA is $7.25 ... so, times that by 258 hours and you will have $1870.50 ... (a rough calculation at todays exchange rate will give you £1128.98 ... which will give you a cryus 8xp, a naim nait xs, a Leema pulse, moon i-1, and a few others

some 'excerpts from current WHF reviews:

Naim nait XS: Loses grip on the deepest bass

Leema pulse: Can sound lightweight and querulous

moon i-1:Lacks the detail of the very best; low frequencies could be more taut

and I've never read a bad review on the Pioneer SA-9800

What are you talking about?? Those amps you mention didn't get bad reviews. The Naim, "The Nait XS is as musically engrossing an amplifier as we've heard at this price point. It'll worry the class leaders" 5 stars. The Leema, " For: Decent levels of build; extensive specification; fast, precise sound. Against: Can sound lightweight and querulous if poorly partnered (you missed out that part!), 5 stars. The Moon i-1, " The Moon's lack of all-out precision holds it back from five, but four stars in this competitive sector is still mighty impressive", 4 stars. Are you telling me that the Pioneer was reviewed and didn't have one slight discrepancy against it??

just quoting the WHF reviews ... I never made that up ... read for yourself

Are you telling me that the Pioneer was reviewed and didn't have one slight discrepancy against it? 

show me one

Yes im still using 20 year old Kef C75 floorstanders bought in 1991..Mid range a and high range are still clear and wide today though more bass would be better or maybe the bass drivers are wearing out.These were the first uni q speakers .

dim_span:

just quoting the WHF reviews ... I never made that up ... read for yourself

Are you telling me that the Pioneer was reviewed and didn't have one slight discrepancy against it? 

show me one

You have been highly selective in only picking the 'againsts' rather than the overwhelming positive points of a few reviews. And only from one publication.

Your challenge (to find discrepencies with your own amp) is ridiculous given that it was made 30 years ago, and it is highly unlikely any WHF (or other magazine's) online reviews exist unless - after a lot of digging - someone has scanned a reprint as a .pdf somewhere or someone here has an attic full of 1978 - 1980 reviews. (Even assuming it was reviewed back then.)

I am not even sure WHF existed in 1978 when your amp was first made.

Some of these old Japanese amps from the late 1970s were very good (and some still are) but to suggest that it only received universal and total acclaim (with no 'buts' about it's performance at all) and then challenge other people to find otherwise is lazy. If you are certain of this - because you have access to the contemporary magazine reviews - then pop them them up here for us to look at.

Obviously your 'negative' points about the modern amps - that you highlighted/cherrypicked from WHF reviews - means that (to keep the playing field level and fair) you will need to provide all the positive evidence about your Pioneer from similarly conducted magazine reviews and not internet testimony from individuals on web forums.

Hey Chebby ... just winding people up!

still would love to find a review of the Sa-9800 ... have searched far and wide and not found one ... can however say that I have never read a bad comment from people who own them

i think it has improved the amp has imo but speakers i am not so sure about
i have 27 year old rogers ls/35a bbc speakers, and i keep going back to them
as i upgrade my hifi ,these are a classic speakers and still sing afer all these yrs
and still work perfectly, they also sell for silly money on ebay but i like them so
much i wont part with them my friends also love  what they do for such a small speaker,
anyone else own them if so what do you think of them..

The LS3/5a speakers are legendary and highly sought after ... some are fetching £1500+ and people from the far east are buying like crazy as these are superb for a home cinema setup aswell as for hifi ...

there were different compaines producing these LS3/5A speakers and as far as I am aware, the Chartwell ones are the best ... here is an interesting comparisson/shootout

http://www.ls35a.com/ scroll a bit down the page and click on the link LS3/5A shootout