Have your say & ask the experts

So I've bought a little T class trends audio ta 10.1 amp for the kitchen and thought I'd see if it could power my '40s.

It did. Perfectly well. I'm not saying it sounded as good as my 909 but given it was a tenth of the price I'd be gutted if it had. The top end is more shrill and the sound isn't as fluid but the volumes ok and the sound is quite acceptable.

I've been a bit worried that by buying the ATCs I've limited myself to hulking great power amps but given that the TA 10.1 is only 10w per channel I'm less concerned now.

Which brings me back to the title of the post ...

 

ime, it depends on the speakers.  unless your t class amp has a lot of current output, it would struggle to get anything decent from certain dyn's, for example.

lordmortlock:

So I've bought a little T class trends audio ta 10.1 amp for the kitchen and thought I'd see if it could power my '40s.

It did. Perfectly well. I'm not saying it sounded as good as my 909 but given it was a tenth of the price I'd be gutted if it had. The top end is more shrill and the sound isn't as fluid but the volumes ok and the sound is quite acceptable.

I've been a bit worried that by buying the ATCs I've limited myself to hulking great power amps but given that the TA 10.1 is only 10w per channel I'm less concerned now.

Which brings me back to the title of the post ...

 

Ive just posted a question about getting a more powerful amp for my 40s. The sound of the treble with my Arcams is really starting to grate on me!! Its ok for short low volume sessions or background music. This is less annoying with my Systemdek than my cd player. If you get anywhere near a decent volume its very wearing though. The clarity even at low volumes is amazing mind you. Especially with acoustic instruments.

 

Just my experience though!

For me, after lots of swapping and changing, the single most important thing about building a good system is SYNERGY. The interface between the amp and speakers is absolutely vital. Take the Quad 11Ls for example. Not particularly difficult to drive but they sound absolutely lifeless on the end of an Arcam A70. Power them with a Yamaha A-S700 or Pioneer A400 on the other hand, and they sing beautifully.

In terms of driving different speakers I've actually found that the current delivery (and particularly the quality of the amp's transformer) is far more important than the unit's out-and-out power rating. This is why 40wpc Rotels can sound far more powerful and convincing than another amp that is rated at 80wpc, for example. This is also why seemingly lower powered NADs can pack such a big punch without sounding strained.

interesting your comments about the t-class

im just rigging up mine in the shed with some q acoustics 1010s and have just tested the connection with my ipod shuffle and have to say theres audible distortion at relatively low volumes but the real test is when ive rigged up the ae

My understanding was that if the amp doesn't have enough power to handle the peaks of the current draw from the speakers then it will clip. If it clips then you can damage your speakers. I don't understand the numerical nature of this relationship but I do understand that my bank account can't cope with another big debit from my local dealer...

Fair comment!

 I remember reading somewhere about the T class frippery meaning that these amps do bat a bit above their average output wise so perhaps thats part of it. It'll certainly do the job it was bought for (driving an old 2.1 system in the kitchen) and it really is very tiny - palm of the hand job.

I have an old pair of Leak sandwich speakers connected to an old pioneer SX-700L receiver/amp .... at the 7 o'clock position, the speakers are near full throttle! ... different sounding speakers, but actually not too bad (for the £10 paid)!  ... bass is pretty awesome and am very surprised at the clarity

as for a better comaparison .... with my B&W DM2 speakers, the Pioneer SA-9800 amp really brings out the best in the speakers (100 watts) as compared to the Pioneer A400 - 60 watts (which is also very good) ...

so yes, amps do make a big difference to the speakers IMHO

now its rigged up to the ae the little t-amp is sounding rather good and plenty loud enough at a low volume setting

however i did ruin the first non budget speakers i had by using an amp way below the speakers recommended minimum so have always gone for too much power rather than too little since

one off:

now its rigged up to the ae the little t-amp is sounding rather good and plenty loud enough at a low volume setting

however i did ruin the first non budget speakers i had by using an amp way below the speakers recommended minimum so have always gone for too much power rather than too little since

I recently bought a pair of marantz speakers (for £14) ... hooked them up to a Pioneer SX700L receiver/amp .... popped them there and then within seconds (both speakers) .... thought the amp/receiver was faulty ... just carp speakers I suppose

I have read that it is always better to get an amp that has more power than the rated power of the speakers, so as to bring the best out of the speakers ... but one has to be carefull with the volume control

bobbyg81:

lordmortlock:

So I've bought a little T class trends audio ta 10.1 amp for the kitchen and thought I'd see if it could power my '40s.

It did. Perfectly well. I'm not saying it sounded as good as my 909 but given it was a tenth of the price I'd be gutted if it had. The top end is more shrill and the sound isn't as fluid but the volumes ok and the sound is quite acceptable.

I've been a bit worried that by buying the ATCs I've limited myself to hulking great power amps but given that the TA 10.1 is only 10w per channel I'm less concerned now.

Which brings me back to the title of the post ...

 

Ive just posted a question about getting a more powerful amp for my 40s. The sound of the treble with my Arcams is really starting to grate on me!! Its ok for short low volume sessions or background music. This is less annoying with my Systemdek than my cd player. If you get anywhere near a decent volume its very wearing though. The clarity even at low volumes is amazing mind you. Especially with acoustic instruments.

 

Just my experience though!

Is your room acousticly good? Is your elecktricity noise free? Do you use some form of conditioning?

I also have a Class T-amp, the Yulong Ampone. Rated 40 watt per channel (they claim).

It did sound good with Dynaudio and Spendor and not bad with my Wharfedale's, MA's were good to on it. I also tried it on my systen with my Hyperion 938 speakers. It did sound analog and tubey on the midrange which was a plus compared to my current amp but it lacked the drive, punch and detail, not that there was no detail but i compared this to a Red Rose Mark Levinson! I don't wanna count how many T-amps you can buy for this. I read these T-amps sound at their best with sensetive speakers like Klipsch. But by connecting this amp i heard to my current setup i learned some benefits of this T-amp, i needed a nice natural midrange in my current setup which i tweaked with a speaker cable (Anti cable), a mains cable (WireWorld), the Rotthwell Attenuators and i used a tube DAC. All in a quest to make my detailed, a bit upfront but somewhat cold sounding amp a bit more a relaxing sounding.

http://dood.ca/2008/09/26/yulong-amp4780-integrated-amp-review/

http://www.redrosemusic.com/literature/affirmation.pdf

Personally, I think too little is made the importance of the
amplifier. The amplifier is acting as the window in your system. It has
to receive the signal from your source components, pass it on to the
power amplification without doing anything to it (extremely hard), and
then it's power amplifier section has to firmly tell your speakers what
to do. If the amplifier doesn't have a vice like grip on your speakers
and have enough current for them, then your speakers are
underperforming.

Low sensitivity and particularly low impedance
speakers need more current than the average amplifier can normally
provide. There are very few low powered amplifiers that can drive these
sort of speakers - the Naim Nait 1 and 2, Sugden A21 are a few that
spring to mind - all other amplifiers are going to be unstable driving
these sort of speakers, even if they're within their normal operating
parameters.

Half of the problem is that many people have heard
average amplification on high quality speakers, and because of this,
spread it around on forums that these speakers don't sound very good.
The same can be said of people that buy expensive discontinued
speakers, and use them on their average hi-fi amplifer, or even worse,
an AV receiver. Yes, there will be some benefits to this, but the
pairing is far from an ideal match. Hence you find the often quoted "I
tried them and didn't like them at all", or "not worth their asking
price".

One thing I would like to clear up -  we're not just talking about high volumes here, we're also talking about low
levels. If the amplifier doesn't have enough current fullstop, it's not
going to make the speakers sound any good, regardless of the volume.
Even if a 70wpc amp is only chucking out 20wpc, the speakers can sound dull and lacking life.

As matthewpiano states, synergy is extremely important. Some amplifiers just don't work with some speakers fullstop, and some sing.

A loudspeaker constructor (don't remember his name) once said that badly constructed speakers are picky, both on amplifiers and on positioning -- while a good construction will sound good no matter what.

If so, some expensive speakers are badly constructed... But then such constructions promote the sale of expesive amplifiers...

I've had a pair of relatively inexpensive speakers (from a high quality manufacturer, and a legendary constructor) for ages, and to my ears they sound very much the same (I like to think of it as 'neutral'), independently of amplifier (from 25W and up) and positioning.

While, on the other side, changing speakers on the same amplifier might change the sound completely. 

So, my answer to the main question would be:

It very much depend on the speakers. 

I just can't agree with that Fahnsen.

As I said before the relationship between the amplifier and speakers is crucial to a successful system. I have heard for myself the differences between different amplifiers and the way in which speakers react differently depending on the amp used.

My Quad example above illustrates this only too well. The Quads are a well made and well designed speaker at their price point but partnering with a suitable amplifier is crucial to achieving the sound of which they are capable.

In fact, a well designed speaker will be more revealing of what the amplifier is or isn't doing, in the same way that a quality amp and speaker set-up is more revealing of source quality.

Far too much emphasis is placed on single areas of a system when the overall synergy between each and every constituent component (including source, amplification, speakers/headphones, cables and supports) can make the difference between success and a musical train crash.